October has flown by, and Election Day is on the horizon. Emotions are running high. The personal is political and engaging in civil discourse with someone of opposing political views can feel comparable to a personal attack. This is all the more difficult when that someone is family. Is it possible to maintain relationships which our family members who espouse starkly different politics from our own?

Dr. Richelle Moen is a psychologist with MHealth Fairview as well as an assistant professor of psychiatry with the University of Minnesota Medical School. Her focuses include psychotherapy, particularly family and group therapy, as well as counseling and human development. Moen joined The Current's Jill Riley for this week's Wellness Wednesday to discuss strategies for having conversations with those family members who are on a different page politically, what the benefit can be of doing so, and why it's important to love our family outside of these conversations.

Listen to the interview above, and read a transcript of the complete conversation below. Every Wednesday morning at 8:30 CDT, Morning Show host Jill Riley connects with experts and local personalities for some real talk about keeping our minds and bodies healthy — from staying safe in the music scene, to exercising during a pandemic, to voting and civic engagement.

Looking for more resources and support? Visit our friends at Call to Mind, MPR's initiative to foster new conversations about mental health. Also, check out mnvotes.org for more details on how to vote in Minnesota.

Election Day is next week. Believe it or not, next Tuesday. And you know what, we thought for this week's Wellness Wednesday, superproducer Anna and I were talking about how families are getting along, how friend groups are getting along right now across the political spectrum, and can we get along better during this time of such a deeply divided country? You know, family, friends, colleagues, even people on the internet, even though in this segment we can talk more about the people who are real in-person loved ones. I think maybe we should work on those relationships first.

But I have some help with that this morning. Dr. Richelle Moen, an assistant professor of psychiatry in the University of Minnesota Medical School, and a psychologist with MHealth Fairview. And her clinical interests include family interventions, family therapy, individual therapy. Dr. Moen, thank you for joining The Current's Morning Show.

Sure, thanks for having me.

In this time of such a deeply divided country, does that mean that families have to be divided? Do we really have to be so divided with our loved ones in our family unit?

See, the hope is that the relationship is more important than actually the political views. If we kind of come down to it, we want to maintain that relationship, and I think one of the questions is "How can we have different values and different beliefs and still maintain those close relationships to family and friends?" So, it's actually how we talk about it and how do we accept the other person. What we know is that you really can't change someone's beliefs and values by arguing, for example.

Mm hmm. Been there, right!

Yes.

Is it possible to engage in some kind of civil discourse with our family members? I mean, wouldn't we be missing out on learning something?

You know, that's true. And, once again, how do we do that? And how do we choose words, and how do we listen? And when do we know when to kind of take a break from those conversations? And, quite frankly, some people, it's so emotional for them, it would be very difficult for them to really have a two-way discourse. So, it might be Uncle Henry is very set in his ways, and, you know, then when he gets going, then it's an argument. So, talking about that over Thanksgiving probably would not be helpful. It could be, though, that Aunt Jane, that I could have a little bit of a conversation with her. But these are the parts of the political issues I'm gonna choose, so some specifics. And then you want to actually use "I" statements and why you believe in that, with not having the notion that you want to change their beliefs, but you want to see if they're interested or willing to hear your point of view. So, for say, you know, "Would you like to hear what my point of view is on this?"

That's a really good point because, you know, when you enter into a conversation, you know, if you speak from your own point of view and your own values, and then you ask questions of the other person, that's a more civil way to have the conversation. You're not gonna change another person's mind with one conversation, but how do you disagree and keep talking with each other?

One of the strategies is, we use the term in different ways, but it's validation. That you validate the other person's thoughts, feelings, beliefs, or behaviors, even if you don't agree with them. And then it allows you the opportunity to then talk a little bit more about what you believe in. So, if the person knows that you've heard them, I can give my view and some stories and why it is important to me, but then I really need to listen to my aunt and why it is important to her, possibly in a different way.

And now, even in the clinical setting of family therapy, families come in for counseling and therapy for a number of reasons, but, you know, I imagine that this whole thing that we're talking about of using the "I" statements and listening and asking questions. I mean, on paper, it really seems like that is almost an easy structure, you know, like those are the instructions on how to have a conversation with a family member, but I imagine that it's not as easy as it sounds when you're putting it into practice.

That's very true. One of the things we talk a lot about in family therapy is that, how can you have a conversation. And when you notice yourself that you're escalating inside or you notice their tone of voice is increasing, and it sounds like you're lecturing or it sounds like you're being judgmental, how do you take a deep breath and slow it down and calm down. And you might even say, "Hey," you know, "why don't we take a few minutes and then come back and talk?"

The other thing I talk with my patients about is that, at Thanksgiving, you find that you're kind of in a conversation with someone and that it's not going well and I don't know what to do, you can always say, you know, "Excuse me, I really need to go to the restroom." And then actually you don't come back. So, you need kind of an exit plan. But if you can come back and you're centered and allow yourself to come in in a non-judgmental way and kind of listen and validate, then you could come back and have that conversation.

Well, this is a great conversation to have, especially with Election Day coming up, and, you know, we may not know the results of the election on Election Night this year because voting in a pandemic has been very this year in the way that people are voting, but we do know that this is not the first time that we've had an election in this country and that families can get divided over their political views or their own values. And your bond with your family and the love of your family and the relationship, you've got to remember to maybe prioritize that first.

Absolutely. You know, we choose our friends, but we don't choose our family. And how do we be respectful and know that it's ok if they think differently or they feel differently. We have other things that we can focus on and that unconditional love, and we want to remember that and remember the compassion. If we kind of look at, as a family therapist, is like "how did they get those views?" And so, sometimes thinking about kind of what their lives were like, where they came from and the era that they were raised in, you know, kind of informs how they are. We can be different. The cool thing about being an adult, you know, we can be different than our parents, and then how can we accept them and accept our family whom we oftentimes don't see daily. And sometimes it's a little harder if you live with the family members, and that's where family therapy may come in where there's certain rules of engagement that we do have when generations live together, with these hot topics, you know.

And even on the subject of living together, do you see a lot of couples or married couples that are having a hard time engaging maybe even in a civil discourse about politics? I mean, I will just say that I am married to someone who doesn't share my political views. Like, and that's just the way it is, but we're still married to each other, we still have a family! But, do you find that that's been kind of a hot topic as well?

As I see couples and families, there's a lot of other issues going on, and oftentimes focus can shift to the politics. And so, one of the things we do, we kind of parcel different topics out, and when somebody's kind of coming together and there's a lot of difficulties, it may be that what we need to do right now is just radically accept that we have different views because we need to right now work on parenting. And it's also very important that children see parents having a discourse or a discussion and not an argument over politics or anything, you know, because we want to show them conflict resolution. And some of these conflicts aren't gonna be resolved. It really is radically accepting the other person in who they are and why you love them. You may not love them because of their politics, but there's a whole lot of other things that is there to love.

Well, this has been a great conversation, and we've been using Uncle Henry as an example, but maybe, you know, throw Uncle Henry a bone this year and just sit down and ask him some questions. You might just learn something, and he may appreciate the fact that someone is finally asking for his opinion!

Absolutely!